Socket 7 into 2011

Off topic chat and stuff that doesn't fit elsewhere.
mikemex
Newbie K6'er
Posts: 22
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2011 11:00 pm
Location: Mexico

Post by mikemex » Tue Jun 28, 2011 9:26 pm

I'm learning a lot of things, that page DonPedro posted has been very illustrative (for my purposes, it seems like a SiS 530 motherboard is far more attractive than MVP3 or Aladdin 5 simply because it has PCI 2.2 and most modern PCI cards work with it).

@Jim:

It seems like AMD didn't make good choices back then; to be expected considering they had K7 architecture already. I wonder: if AMD bothered to add the new 3D Now! instructions to the plus series why didn't they bother to complete i686 compatiblity?

Now, if the ATZ processor ins't a good purchase, where to get one? I've never seen a K6-3+ listed on eBay.

I've never used Everest before. It seems to me that it inflates scores just like Sandra does. In CrystalDiskmark I get 185 MB/s and in Everest (trial version, no idea how to enable the full one) it says 260 MB/s. Latency seems interesting at 149.5 ns. Settings are 2-3-3-6. No idea how to set more aggressive ones.

I have installed so far:

Via PCI Latency Patch
Via Memory Interleave Enabler
Write Allocate Monitor
Via 4in1 4.56v
Catalyst 4.7

Current system configuration:

K6-3 400 AHX (2.4v)
256MB PC133
40GB 7200rpm HDD
Radeon 7500 AGP 32MB (64 bit)
Creative Sound Blaster PCI (ESS1373)
Davicom 33.6 KBps ISA Modem
Intel 2200BG Mini PCI card with MiniPCI to PCI adaptor (internal laptop antennas adapted to the front of the AT case, no protuding stuff)

Seems to be running stable since I disabled AGP 2X.

Benchmarks:

CrystalMark 2004:
11348

7-Zip:
301 MIPS

GL Excess:
1197 XSMarks

I wonder if it is time to make a list of what the machine can and can't do. I tried opening my gmail account and works but it's very slow. I've been using K-Meleon as web browser.
5EHM / K6-3 AHX 400 / 512MB PC133 / Radeon 7500 / Wireless / SB Live! / CD-RW / SATA-PCI + 7K160
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Jim
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Location: Toronto

Post by Jim » Wed Jun 29, 2011 12:18 am

Mike an ATZ isn't all that bad. They were made to the same specifications as all the other K6-3+ chips were. BUT they came from a part of the "Wafer" that was somewhat more prone to have lower abilities. I don't know the exact chance that an ATZ will be a weak one, just that the chance is somewhat higher.

Re the SIS boards, they have a 1/4 divider which lets you run the FSB at 133 MHz without problems, BUT the chipset has such LOUSY memory read and write characteristics, that performance is about the same as an ALi board running at a much lower FSB.

You should be able to enable AGP 2x on all Via boards except the FIC VA503+. Also there are WPCredit tweaks that will immensely improve performance on your board.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card

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Tetrium
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Location: The Netherlands

Post by Tetrium » Wed Jul 06, 2011 3:34 pm

Jim wrote:I ran SuperPuppy 3 for years without problems on a DFI K6BV3+ /66 board (MVP3).

Try running Everest & Sandra on your machine and see what results you get.
I was able to get my DFI up to 5.5 x 103 MHz with no problem running Hynix Ram.
Another thing is you get much better results with the 5.5 multiplier, and a K6+ processor.
Whether it be K6-2+ or K6-3+, prefferably the latter.
This has boggled my mind though. Why would the 5.5x multi be actually better then a 6x multi??
GA-5AX rev 4.1
K6-III/400 AFR (Desktop 2.2v CPU)
256MB PC-100 cl2 SDRAM
TNT2 M64 16MB AGP
Voodoo 2 12MB (single card)
Windows ME (Yes, it rocks ;D)

Jim
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Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim » Wed Jul 06, 2011 5:28 pm

I would assume the reason the 5.5 multiplier works far better than any other, is because there really is no 6 times multiplier. AMD remapped the 2 times multiplier to make it able to serve as a 6 times multiplier; but this was long after the chips were designed. As orriginally designed, it would be logical that they would somehow be "OPTIMIZED" to work best with the highest multiuplier; - 5.5 times.

But that is jjust an attempt to explain the realities of the situation. If you read the test results carefully that appear in the following thread, there is no doubt whatsoever that the 5.5 multiplier works best. And this applies to VIA boards, ALi boards, whatever; so it has to be the processor that is "OPTIMIZED" for 5.5 times. Memory read 361 and Memory write 177 on an ALi board at 5.5 x 112

See this thread for test results : http://www.k6plus.com/index.php?name=PN ... pic&t=1434
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card

mikemex
Newbie K6'er
Posts: 22
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2011 11:00 pm
Location: Mexico

Post by mikemex » Wed Jul 06, 2011 11:19 pm

I'm sorry but I'm skeptical to believe there is something special with the chip using multiplier 5.5. However, I don't know that much about the platform to give another explanation. I'll think about it...

In the meanwhile, I'd like to build a list of what the machine can and can't do:

Runs well:
* DVD Playback in DXVA assisted mode (Power DVD 6).
* Open Office (3.3).
* Old games such as Half Life, Quake 2, etc.
* Most web sites that don't abuse JavaScript run very well (K-Meleon 1.5.4).

Runs but not well:
* DVD in pure software decoding is jumpy (Power DVD 6, Media Player Classic).
* Deus Ex runs but feels slow. This game is very CPU consuming.
* Youtube works in the lowest quality setting (240p). A bit jumpy but sound is fluid. You can listen to music videos well. (Flash Player 10. something)
* GMail works but very slow. I suspect Google Docs runs slow also but I've not tested.
* Tom's Hardware (for example) takes forever to load. It seems like it's flooded with JavaScript ad monitoring.

Doesn't run:
* Most contemporary Linux distros (Ubuntu 11 doesn't run, for example).
* GIMP in Windows (2.6 something). I believe there used to be a i586 version but I've not tried.
* MPEG-4 codecs seem to be compiled for i686 and up. They crash. (XP Codec Pack 2.5.1)
* Most modern drivers for the video cards crash.

I'll keep testing stuff. Suggestions to increase the software base are very welcome.
5EHM / K6-3 AHX 400 / 512MB PC133 / Radeon 7500 / Wireless / SB Live! / CD-RW / SATA-PCI + 7K160
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moondog
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Posts: 42
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2010 5:34 am
Location: Germany
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Post by moondog » Thu Jul 07, 2011 11:01 pm

Hi together,

just wanted to state out that K6 3+ 400 ATZ are still sold on Ebay Germany, for about 8 Euro + shipping... for Mexico 12,90 Euro for example ;)

Here is the link for the auction:

http://cgi.ebay.de/SOKET-7-BOARD-OVERCL ... 20b2848311

He sold already 80 of them, I got mine from him too. I was playing around a lot with all my K6 CPU´s a lot in the past and still do so, but I have to admit, that the 6x multiplier works in nearly all cases awfully with an FSB over 83 Mhz... I think it isn´t a real solution to burn the ATZ 400 with 2,9 Volt just to kick him over the 600 Mhz frontier, esp. since a higher FSB - for example, 110 Mhz@5 kicks more power out of the machine as the multi 6 - and overall is rock stable...

Greetings,

Eric
K6-3+ ATZ 400@616@2,4 Volt
Epox MVP3G5
768 MB Apacer PC133 CL2.0
Geforce 4 TI 4200

IPC Powernote
K6-3+ ATZ 400@500@1,8 Volt (Prime-stable)
512 MB (!!!) PC 133 RAM :-D
Ati Rage Mobility M 4 MB

mikemex
Newbie K6'er
Posts: 22
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2011 11:00 pm
Location: Mexico

Post by mikemex » Sun Jul 10, 2011 3:56 pm

I'd like to purchase one but 12.9 euro for shipping? Mmm...

What voltage are you using at 550 MHz?
5EHM / K6-3 AHX 400 / 512MB PC133 / Radeon 7500 / Wireless / SB Live! / CD-RW / SATA-PCI + 7K160
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Jim
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Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim » Sun Jul 10, 2011 5:16 pm

Probably anywhere from 1.6 volts up to about 2.1 volts. All the various types of K6-3+ processors will pretty well all do 600 MHz at 2.1 volts, unless the particular processor is a not very good one.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card

moondog
Junior K6'er
Posts: 42
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2010 5:34 am
Location: Germany
Contact:

Post by moondog » Mon Jul 11, 2011 1:09 am

Hello again,

atm there is something wrong with my system as it freezes from time to time, I´m running my ATZ @ 2,2 Volt atm. I doubt that the freezes came from the cpu as it doesn´t matter on what speed and voltage I´m running it. I´m still on the hunt for the error...

Apart from this I guess the 400 ATZ is a good one but as Jim stated in another thread there are better around. For mine it´s a fact that playing around with the 6x multiplier is a no go if you go over the 100 Mhz fsb. I matched him to boot at 6x112 but he needed already 2,9 volt for this try and he freezes while loading XP... I guess 616 (5,5x112) is the final peak on this one. Maybe switching of the 2mb onboard cache would help but would kick down the system performance a lot...

btw...

I stumbled over several K6-2+ lately, even the 570 ACZ is sold in the US again... but to be honest, about 40 euros incl. shipping is an exorbitant price...

http://cgi.ebay.de/AMD-K6-III-or-AMD-K6 ... 41585d9a4d

And here some k6-2+ 500 ACR sold in Germany, again quite expensive...

http://cgi.ebay.de/Raritat-CPU-AMD-K6-2 ... 256587a4c2

I guess the 400 ATZ was a good deal then :D

Greetings,

moondog
K6-3+ ATZ 400@616@2,4 Volt
Epox MVP3G5
768 MB Apacer PC133 CL2.0
Geforce 4 TI 4200

IPC Powernote
K6-3+ ATZ 400@500@1,8 Volt (Prime-stable)
512 MB (!!!) PC 133 RAM :-D
Ati Rage Mobility M 4 MB

Jim
K6'er Elite
Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim » Mon Jul 11, 2011 9:55 pm

Try downloading "Rain" and setting it up to run all the time. Might stop your freezing problems. NOTE : Rain is a program that makes use of the Halt command when the system is idleing to allow the CPU to cool off. Works real good, doesn't slow your machine down at all, but does make the CPU run a fair bit cooler.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card

moondog
Junior K6'er
Posts: 42
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2010 5:34 am
Location: Germany
Contact:

Post by moondog » Tue Jul 12, 2011 9:59 am

Hello again...

I think Rain wont run on my system as I have installed XP, the problems I mentioned above obviously came from some false memory options I took in the bios. Since I switched off the bank interleave option the system runs stable again.

So my system is again up and running and since I had some time I sharpened it a bit... :twisted:

Furthermore I gave the CPU a little kick again and it is running now with 616 Mhz@2,4 Volt. To hold it cool I took an Arctic Copper Silent 3 Socket A cooler together with Arctic Silver 5... so far the CPU reaches under load not more than 40 degrees.

I was trying to reanimate my old Voodoo 2 SLI system but it seems one card died :( If I put both cards in and want to start games in Glide the system shortly freezes and goes back to the desktop... one of the cards runs well but so I just get the 800x600 :? Too bad... will try to get another one on Ebay next time...

Greetings,

moondog
K6-3+ ATZ 400@616@2,4 Volt
Epox MVP3G5
768 MB Apacer PC133 CL2.0
Geforce 4 TI 4200

IPC Powernote
K6-3+ ATZ 400@500@1,8 Volt (Prime-stable)
512 MB (!!!) PC 133 RAM :-D
Ati Rage Mobility M 4 MB

mikemex
Newbie K6'er
Posts: 22
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2011 11:00 pm
Location: Mexico

Post by mikemex » Wed Jul 27, 2011 1:21 pm

Thanks Andrej.

I'm having a weird issue. I just installed the remaining 256MB for 512MB on my Soyo 5EHM system but performance is greatly reduced. I'm aware that with 1MB the top 256MB are not cached by the motherboard but shouldn't the K6-3's cache compensate for it?

In performance tests, L2 cache has dropped from 1.5 GB/s to about 150 MB/s. I was suspecting an error in the cache level detection but memory performance in CrystalMark 2004 has dropped to about half.

All in all, it seems like the processor's L2 cache has been disabled.
5EHM / K6-3 AHX 400 / 512MB PC133 / Radeon 7500 / Wireless / SB Live! / CD-RW / SATA-PCI + 7K160
Stuff

Jim
K6'er Elite
Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim » Wed Jul 27, 2011 5:11 pm

If PCR files are available for your chipset, you can check ALL the chipset setting with WPCredit.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card

mikemex
Newbie K6'er
Posts: 22
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2011 11:00 pm
Location: Mexico

Post by mikemex » Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:15 pm

It turned out to be that the BIOS is flawed and it enables Write Combining, Write Allocation, etc. for 256MB and 384MB but not for 512MB.

I'm enabling it with WAMonitor and everything seems to be working fine. I'm investigating to see if some add-on card is causing it because it seems weird.
5EHM / K6-3 AHX 400 / 512MB PC133 / Radeon 7500 / Wireless / SB Live! / CD-RW / SATA-PCI + 7K160
Stuff

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