Superpuppy 3 Setup

Discussion relating to Socket 7 hardware.
Jim
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Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim » Mon Jan 09, 2006 9:19 pm

I have been having some problems lately with both of my main machines. On Superpuppy 3 these stem from running PC133 CL3 / PC100 CL2 RAM @ 112 w/ the CL2 settings while running OS Mark. This resulted in a fair bit of file corruption, (even extending into the partition containing my backups), which Windows XP Pro, to its credit was able to withstand; and continue to operate for some time. That is no longer the case; and I have been forced to do a complete reinstall of the XP side of the dualboot on that machine. In the case of Superpuppy 2, again I was running OS Mark w/ the FSB @ 112, this time w/ a processor that was defective in terms of heat disapation capacity. Again the result was file corruption, though not nearly as extensive; and my backups survived intact.

Superpuppy 2 has been rebuilt w/ a new processor; and heat sinks added to all the major chips on the mobo. (The photo files for the rebuild are mostly on Superpuppy-3, however so right now I can't get at them). Superpuppy 3 is going down to get an upgrade rebuild now, which will entail the modification of, and installation of my DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 2Meg cache board before I do the reinstall on the XP side. When all that is finished, you may expect some new test results to appear in my "K6-3+450 ACZ Under / Over Clocking Results" post.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card

Jim
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Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim » Thu Nov 02, 2006 9:36 pm

Having finally gotten around to messing with Corel Capture, thought I would show visually how I setup my machines. My Desktop looks like this :

Image

Click "My Computer" and you get this :

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Click on "Artwork" and you get shortcuts to everything relevent to picture creation, enhancing, and display.

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Click on "Audio" and you get this :

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Click "CD Creator", and you get this :

Image

Clicking "Internet" gives you this :

Image

Clicking "Utilities" gives :

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Click "Disk"; and you get :

Image

Clicking "File" gets you :

Image

Clicking "System" opens :

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Clicking "Video" opens :

Image

Clicking "Writing" gets you :

Image

And finally as explained in the foregoing post, the "Start Menu" is setup the same way.

Image

These screen shots are actually taken from Superpuppy 5; but I use the same setup on all my machines, except that SP3 has a lot more software installed. Works pretty good for me.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card

Jim
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Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim » Wed Jan 10, 2007 11:54 pm

Tried installing the ATI Catalyst 6.11 drivers on SP3 along w/ the "Catalyst Control Centre", and MSs "Net Framework 2", (required by the "Catalyst Control Centre". Result was machine became extremely unstable. Just trying to go online caused a system crash, (complete w/ file check files.) Recommend don't try it; - waste of time.

NOTE : Tried hard. Several attempts starting over by reloading Windopes XP from scratch to see if some error on my part was causing the problem. Finally got an error free attempt w/ same results.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card

DonPedro
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Posts: 575
Joined: Wed Jul 27, 2005 2:11 pm

Post by DonPedro » Thu Jan 11, 2007 4:28 pm

jim,
was that your first try ever to install catalyst 611 together with conctrol center on xp? I mean, did that combination ever work before?

Jim
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Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim » Thu Jan 11, 2007 8:02 pm

Answer : Yes previously used either 4.7 cats w/ XP & 3.9 w/ 98-SE. No, never previously tried. But like I said tried hard this time. Got it up and running a few times, but in spite of being pretty cautious it was NG. Possibly the fact that I don't use "Service Pack 2", (I use 1A fully updated), may have had something to do w/ it. Seemed ok, but when I went to go online, as soon as I clicked my mouse into the search box to type "K6Plus" got a crash. Another time was trying to close a popup, - crash. Did get the "Catalyst Control Centre" to work ok. Found out that my ATI 9000 Radeon aiw's core is clocked @ 275 MHz and its DRAM is clocked @ 270 MHz.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card

Jim
K6'er Elite
Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim » Mon Jan 22, 2007 5:54 pm

NOTE : Have also had stability problems w/ the 4.10 Cats. Have gone back to using the 4.7 which works ok (EDIT) as far as stability is concerned. There has been, however, a shutdown problem under WINXP-PRO. Took a while to nail it down this much; but the problem surfaces after the ATI drivers and controll panel have been installed. The machine will still do a normal restart, (which makes the problem more difficult to isolate), but on a full shutdown, it hangs at the "Windows is Shutting Down" screen. This is "P"ing me off. I don't know how many times I have formatted my "C" drive and started over on account of this; but it is several. Took me quite a while to realize it was ATI causing it, because normally after installing software, you just do a restart, not a full shutdown.

Any help on that problem from anyone who is familiar w/ it would be appreciated.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card

Jim
K6'er Elite
Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim » Sat Feb 24, 2007 12:12 pm

I am still stuck on this "Shutdown" problem. Have isolated what is causing it; but not solved it. Load XP, computer shuts down fine. Update XP, computer still shuts down fine. Load mother board drivers computer still shuts down fine. But the minute I load the ATI Cat 4.7 8-03-040610a-016126c AGP Card driver the machine starts hanging at the "Windows is Shutting Down" screen instead of continuing on to the "It Is Safe To Shut Off Your Computer Now" screen. Anybody have any thoughts on how to solve this?
mulvihill wrote:Hi Jim, I am not exactly clear on the OS. If it is, as you say, SP3, are we talking about W2K or XP Pro SP2?
In any case, if you have APM enabled in Power Options, then it sounds like a driver problem and would recommend cleaning out all parts of old drivers with Driver Cleaner
I've had similar problems with the AIW9000.
To which I replied : Sorry, SP3 to me is my short form for "Superpuppy-3" which is my name for the machine. The OS is WINXP-PRO w/ Service Pack 1a installed. I do not use Service Pack 2. Re old drivers, when I first encountered this prob, I formatted the HDD and started over. (Several times) There were no old drivers, other than the one that WINXP supplies when it recognizes hardware. (It DOES supply some sort of driver for the 9000, because you get a lot more than 16 colours right from the getgo.) Re "Driver Cleaner", where do you get that? Are we talking shareware or does it cost?

Thanks again Mulvihill.
mulvihill wrote:Then I would guess that the problem lies with APM which does not have the savvy of ACPI when it comes to installing hardware. For that, you will have to "mod in" an ATX PSU (easily done), enable ACPI in the BIOS and reinstall Windows. It's probably safe to assume that you have the latest BIOS.
The words "Driver Cleaner" in the last post are a live link to Softpedia, but if you have a clean install of Windows then it shouldn't be necessary. There is a free version and there is a $10 Pro version.
To which I replied : Re ATX supply, no. I just bought 3x 300Watt Antec AT supplies. My machines are all ATs. Purist me, (or old fashioned dope if you prefer), anyway will try the driver cleaner. Right now the machine is at "Uptown Computer" to see if ROGER the super genius, tech, hacker, etc, can solve the prob. Already he has made headway, when I took it in it always hung at the "Windows Is Shutting Down" screen, now sometimes it goes through to the "It Is Safe To Shut Down Your Computer" screen. So he can probably solve it, AT supply and all. And thanks for the link. Will download.

EDIT : By the way while we are talking, do you happen to have any suggestions on how to get a Radeon 8500LE working in an ASUS P5A-B? I have tried everything I can think of. The board's AGP slot tests good, w/ another AGP card, and the 8500 tests good in another board. But put the 8500 in the ASUS board; and its no video. The ASUS supports 2x AGP and the 8500LE has 2x & 4x so it should work.

Well ROGER did solve the problem; and Mulvihill was right, it was driver related. Anyway the shutdown problem is solved and it is on with troubleshooting other things now.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card

larrystotler
Newbie K6'er
Posts: 12
Joined: Tue Feb 06, 2007 1:45 am

Post by larrystotler » Wed Feb 28, 2007 9:13 pm

Jim - That's definately an interesting setup. However, I had a couple of questions about it. When you said that you have issues with XP and 98SE installed on the same drive, why not use 2 different drives? And, if the bios supports it, you can switch the boot drive order. I know not all bios's support this, but some do. You could also install 2 drives with an OS on each one and then manually install GRUB. Grub doesn't actually boot Windows, it chainloads to the Windows boot loader. I've never tried setting it up without Linux, but it is possible.

FAT32 should be limited to a 2GB file size, not 4GB.

Also, no Firefox? I personally wouldn't run ExPloder on the internet at all. Firefox is much more secure. Just my humble opinion.

Tip: Win98SE will format a partition larger than 30GB with FAT32 where XP will not. Create the partition under XP, and then boot into 98SE and format the drive. It will happily format it until it is done even tho it won't report the proper size. I do this all the time.

Jim
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Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim » Wed Feb 28, 2007 11:48 pm

The major issue w/ regard to my dualboot, is that if you use the XP bootloader setup, XP sticks its big nose, (Ntloader and some other item I forget), and fat ass, (Pagefile.sys), into the win98 partition, because the 98 partition has to come first if they are both on the same drive. i.e 98 gets "C" while XP gets "D". Given that, XP loads parts of itself into "C". 98 sees these intrusions as garbage, and will constantly give messages about the recycle bin format being incorrect, again complements of XP butting into partitions other than its own.

That is why I use Partition Magic. Partition Magic allows both partitions to use the "C" letter by turn, and hides the two OS partitions from each other. i.e. neither 98, nor XP can see each other when setup not to by Partition Magic.

Re setting up the OSs on separate drives That is the sort of thing I was going to do w/ Superpuppy 4. The plan for that machine, was not to put jumpers on the HDDs; but rather to use those two wire connectors that are the same size as jumpers, to connect to an automatic switching system, which would allow me to reset which drive was master and which drive was slave by way of external switches on the machine. Because inadvertant switching of the master slave relationship of the drives while the machine was powered up would likely result in HDD destruction, I designed an automatic switching system which could only function while the machine was powered down. That is to say you could manually switch the master slave relationship while the machine was powered up; but the actual switching would not take effect until the next time the machine was powered down. Because solid state electronics inherantly involve voltage drops, (i.e. .6V for diode or transistor), I had to design the automatic switching circuit using relays to insure that the HDD jumper functions were not affected by all this. Problem is that relays have a limited lifespan and will eventually fail. That is why I abbandoned the Superpuppy 4 project when the case mods were well advanced. i.e. it has an independant shielded auxilliary power supply, w/ its own separate cooling system built into the case to power the switching system that I designed etc.

Re Fat32 filesize, I have created scanner files up to 2.5 Gig; and Partition backup files ranging up to just under 4 Gig. It was when a backup crapped out trying to go over the 4 Gig boundary, that I changed my "D" drive structure, and made the post you are refering to.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card

Prime
Newbie K6'er
Posts: 9
Joined: Sat Sep 09, 2006 8:51 pm
Location: Alberta, Canada

MultiBoot

Post by Prime » Tue Mar 06, 2007 12:46 pm

Jim, Here is an ebay link to a hardware IDE switch. This would allow you to boot from three different hard drives. It has built in safety features to not allow a switch over while drive is powered. A friend owned an older version of this called a Romtec TriOS about 5 years ago, it worked well for him.
http://cgi.ebay.ca/COMBOX-Hard-Drive-Se ... dZViewItem

Jim
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Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

RE: MultiBoot

Post by Jim » Wed Mar 07, 2007 8:13 am

Thanks. That is interesting; but if I understand it correctly, the drives in that setup are completely isolated. i.e. The OS on each drive can only see its own drive. My setup in Superpuppy 3 allows any OS to see everything except any other OS. The planned setup for Superpuppy 4 would have allowed the OS on either drive on the primary IDE cable to see the entire machine, w/ the master slave relationship, (and hence the "C" drive letter), changing between them. ___ (Though when I think about it the letters of the other partitions on those drives would have been changing too, so it becomes something like the setup given by the item you mention except that each OS would be able to see the other, and hence could be used to repair the other if necessary.)
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card

Jim
K6'er Elite
Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Shutdown Problem Solved

Post by Jim » Sun Mar 25, 2007 8:12 pm

OK. Well, Rogers method of solving the shutdown problem had an undesired side-effect. He was working on a bench with 15 inch monitors, and when I got the machine home, I found the screen size locked at 15 inch. You could set the resolution at whatever you liked, i.e. 768 x 1024; and you would get it, but at 15 inch screen size. (Mentioned it to Roger; and he said he didn't know why that would happen, that he didn't do anything to cause that.) So I wiped it and started over again. This time I seem to have solved it. Oddly enough the solution was ENABLE ACPI. Usually machines w/ AT power supplies have shutdown problems w/ ACPI enabled. The DFI K6BV3+/66 board is different. It has shutdown problems w/ AT power supplies w/ ACPI disabled. Thought I'd pass that little item along, to hopefully save someone else the many hours of time I have wasted on it.

EDIT : Well the DFI K6BV3+/66 is wierder than I realized. You MUST enable ACPI in the bios if you are using an AT power supply, or you WILL have shutdown problems w/ WINXP-PRO. BUT if running WIN98-SE you WILL have shutdown problems if you are using an AT power supply and ACPI is enabled. That means if using an AT power supply you MUST enable ACPI for WINXP-PRO; and disable ACPI for WIN98-SE. Makes dualboots on these boards tricky.

Fortunately, (God Bless Mulvihill), the Mulvihill trick works. So to get both sides of an XP/98 dualboot shutting down properly on a DFI K6BV3+/66 when running an AT powersupply :

1) Enable ACPI in the bios so that XP will shut down properly.
2) When you run the initial install of 98-SE from the 98 boot floppy, first type the letter of your CDROM drive; e.g. "D:" then type "SETUP /P I" when installing Windopes from your CDROM drive to disable ACPI for 98-SE.

Because the /P I command works later in the boot sequence it only comes into play once the 98 boot has been chosen; and therefore does not affect the XP boot. Because the /P I command overrides the bios setting, it works to disable ACPI for the 98 boot despite ACPI being enabled in the bios for the benefit of XP. That way both OSs will shut down properly despite their conflicting requirements.
Last edited by Jim on Thu Apr 12, 2007 12:30 am, edited 4 times in total.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card

Jim
K6'er Elite
Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Reinstalling Software

Post by Jim » Mon Apr 02, 2007 8:36 pm

Am gradually getting my software reinstalled on SP3. Lot of work; and pain in the A**. Running "Registry First Aid", reveals the many errors that software comes w/, and it takes hours of close concentration to sort it all out so you finally have a clean, (and working), install. Gonna plug "Registry First Aid" here. When "Crap Cleaner" found "No Issues" RFA found 155. Where "Crap Cleaner" or "Registry Mechanic" find errors and have no better suggestion than "Delete the Entry", RFA may come up with as many as a dozen possible suggested corrections. VERY TEDIOUS to go through upwards of 600 registry errors with it, but I don't know of any other program that gives better results.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card

User avatar
Uranium235
Senior K6'er
Posts: 183
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2005 9:59 pm

Post by Uranium235 » Wed Apr 04, 2007 9:42 am

Have you ever used JV16 Powertools? The registry cleaner is alot easier to use but doesn't find nearly as many errors as Registry First Aid. The freeware version 1.3 is what I use. Newer versions are shareware.
Get it here:
http://www.oldversion.com/program.php?n=jv16

Jim
K6'er Elite
Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim » Wed Apr 04, 2007 6:00 pm

Haven't tried that one; but since the purpose of these programs is to identify and fix problems, I think I'll stick w/ RFA. It is very thorough in the way it goes about checking the registry. But thanks for the link.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card

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