K6-2 533 overclock question?

Discussion relating to Socket 7 hardware.
Jim
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Location: Toronto

Post by Jim »

If you get the same numbers or at least something similar from Everest Home 220, then you are getting very good performance indeed, especially for a normal K6-2. Almost unbelievably so. The "Memory Write" is about double what you usually get after tweaking with a K6-3+ on a Super Seven board.
Last edited by Jim on Sat Sep 12, 2009 1:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card
Jake
Newbie K6'er
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Aug 22, 2009 9:09 pm

Post by Jake »

Hi Jim

Feel stupid asking this...tryed to P.M. Stedman ...message ended up in my outbox...not sentbox...did I miss something or is that the way ot works?

Also , those numbers from Hot Cpu are out of whack...that thing is grabbing the directx layer to get those results. Aida32 and Everest Home are reporting something like,....

Read 285
Write 125

Thanks again for all your help

Jake
Jim
K6'er Elite
Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim »

The message being in your outbox instead of your sentbox simply means that Stedman hasn't seen it yet. Once he opens it then it will transfer to your sentbox.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card
Jake
Newbie K6'er
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Aug 22, 2009 9:09 pm

Post by Jake »

I keep seeing references to a utility called "Cacheonw.exe" ...
Does anybody know if it still exists and where?

Jake
Jim
K6'er Elite
Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim »

Never heard of it myself.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card
Jake
Newbie K6'er
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Aug 22, 2009 9:09 pm

Post by Jake »

Hi Jim...

It is listed as "needed" over on the compatibilty List under MSI >>5169.

http://compatlist.k6plus.com/

I have seen references to it over AMD boards also. But all the download links I've seen are dead.

Jake
Jim
K6'er Elite
Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim »

I have these items :

Adobe Accrobat 5.0
Adobe Accrobat 9
ATI Driver Remover
Bullet Proof Adware Spyware
Bios Patcher
The Following Boot Track Utilities
1)MBR Util
2)MBR Wizard
3)MS Disk Probe
4)MS Sector Inspector
5)PQ Utilities
6)Test Disk
Bronx69 Utilities
1)Super CPU Boost
2)Ultra Cache
3)Boost CPU Speed
CPU Cool 8-0-7
CPU Cool 9
CPU Mark 99
CT SPD
Data Recovery Recover It ALL Professional
Defrag Diskeeper 8.0 (Note Perfect Disk 7 is the best defrag progam I have tried)
Driver Cleaner Pro
Driver Heaven
Error Smart
Everest
File Sharing
German Benchmark
Google Toolbar
Hardware Diagnostics
Hynix Old Part # Decoder
IDE Tools the Following :
1)Bad Tracks
2)Manufacturer Software from :
a) Fujitsu
b) IBM Hitachi
c) Maxtor
d) Quantum
e) Samsung
f) Seagate & Conner
g) Western Digital
3)HD TACH 2.7 for 98
4)MB Specs
5)Power Quest
6)THDD
Long Name Unzipper
Mem Test
Mem Test86+ v1.65
Motherboard Monitor
My Doom Worm Remover
O&O Clever Cache
OS Mark
Powertweak
Reg Now Registry Cleaner
Registry Cleaner
Registry First Aid
Registry Mechanic
Registry Rescue
Set K6
Speedfan 4.22
System ID
System Mechanic
System Sandra 2004
Tweaking Utilities The Following :
1) Beyond 115200
2) Cache Booster 98
3) CPU Cool
4) CTU
5) Increase CPU Speed
6) Internet Cable Speedup Patch 98
7) K6 Speed
8) Powertweak 2
9) Rain
10) Super CPU Boost
11) Tweak Bios
12) Ultra Cache
13) WCPU 330
14) WP Credit 1.4
15) WP CreditSet
16) Write Allocate Monitor
The Unoffical Service Pack for WIN98-SE (Reccomended as it raises the amount of RAM 98 can use from 256 Meg to 4 Gig)
UpnP Lan Utility
U-Torrent
Waterfall 123
Win RAR 3.50 Beta 4
Wipe CMOS
Win-Zip v8.0
A Bunch of OLD stuff that I am not even going to bother to list
Norton Utilities 2000 (For WIN98-SE)
Norton System Utilities (For WINXP)
Bios Agent
Dr DOS BIOS Boot Disk
Breese Via
Uniflash Bios Flasher
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card
DonPedro
K6'er Elite
Posts: 578
Joined: Wed Jul 27, 2005 2:11 pm

Post by DonPedro »

hello jake,

here are my wpcr-settings for my gigabyte board (ali-5 chipset). hope it is of help for you ....

I don't know your level of it-knowledge and just in case bits and bytes don't tell you much I would like to let you know that each adress (labelled in hexadecimal notation) of the 256 byte memory area displayed by the wpcredit-tool (from byte # 00 in the upper left corner to byte # FF in the lower right corner; 16 bytes per line, 16 rows) shows - if selected via mouse cursor - the corresponding 8 bits in the right part of the window. each of these bits (sometimes in combination with neighbouring bits) represents information of the current state of the machine. some bits can not be altered, they just show information, others can be altered through user input and change the behaviour of some part of the machine (tweaking). also be aware that the index of the bits of a byte starts with "0" (not with 1) and goes up to index 7 (1 byte = 8 bits). also important to know is that bits of a byte are read from right to left!

1 byte = 8 bits

1 bit can hold either a "1" or a "0"

so a binary (bitwise) representation of a byte looks like this (example decimal value of the byte be 255):

1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1

with index (position)

7 6 5 4 3 2 1 0

bit 0 is the right most bit


for our convenience wpcredit allows to directly locate each bit of an adress (register) by pointing the mouse cursor over the respective bit in the lower part of the window where it says "Bin:" followed by some bit-pattern. by clicking on the desired bit you can watch how an asterisk in the right part of the window indicates the corresponding explanation. if you so have "activated" the bit you wish to change then there is nothing more to do than to key in a "1" or a "0" to change the setup, followed by enter/return-key. sometimes a change needs more than 1 bit to change, then one would change the bits as necessary and finally would press enter/return, like for example with "enhanced page mode counter" - feature, which can be found in register (adress) 5F. the bits to set the value are bit 7 and bit 6 (as you can see from the explanation in the right part of the window). if we would like to set the value of 16 we are told to use bit-pattern "11" which means both bits (7 and 6) are to be set to "1"; if we would like it to have the value of 8 then the bit-pattern is "01". here we are told to set the "lower" bit to "1" (bit 6) and the "higher" bit (bit 7) to "0" - remember lower and higher refers to the index of the bits and that the index goes from right to left.



gigabyte ga-5ax, rev. 5.2.,
k6-3+-550
3x256 ramk, set to 2-2-2-5 memory timings
mainboard cache de-activated !!

operating system windows nt4

bench-tools:

* everest 2.20
read 342 mb/s
write 180 mb/s
latency 197,5 ns

* winrar 3.90 (built-in benchmark)
115 mb/s



adress offsets/bits of interest:
===================
40: (current byte-value of my machine/setup = hex 13)
bit 4 shows status of K6-write allocation mechanism; this feature can be controlled via "k6speed" tool
and should be "activated" for best memory write performance

41: (hex 44)
bit 6 can be set to 1 (fast dram read) if mainboard cache is de-activated; otherwise system might crash

43: (hex f5)
bit 6 dynamic write back set to 1
bit 4/5 set both to 1: dram read pipe mode "fast"
bit 2: dram single write pipe set to 1
bit 0: cache level-2 pipeline function set to 1

48: (hex 1e)
bit 4: set dram cas-latency according to the specs of your ram-module
bit 3/2: set precharge-time according to ......
bit 1/0: set ras cycle time according to ....

49: (hex ef)
bit 4: sdram command wait state set to 0
bit 3: enhanced page mode set to 1
bit 1: sdram internal page detection set to 1
bit 0: pipe function set to 1

4B: (hex 5c)
bit 2: dram sequencing bypass mode set to 1
bit 0: dram posted write buffer set to 0


5F: (hex c0)
bit 7/6 set to 1 = enhanced page mode set to 16

73: (hex 02)
bit 1 sdram command and data output pipeline set to 1
bit 2 dram read pipe function set to 0
Jim
K6'er Elite
Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim »

Jake I checked out the link you posted, and that site is maintained by "King" who is a member here, though he doesn't drop by much any more. I have his email address, maybe he has a copy of that program.
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card
Jake
Newbie K6'er
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Aug 22, 2009 9:09 pm

Post by Jake »

Jim wrote:Jake I checked out the link you posted, and that site is maintained by "King" who is a member here, though he doesn't drop by much any more. I have his email address, maybe he has a copy of that program.
Hi Jim ..

Actually, I just got it...one of the guys over at MSFN found it on the way back machine .... it only deals with the k6-2plus processor's. but it does include a list of motherboards and bios ...maybe you guys would want to put it in your downloads ????

Can wait to reply to DonPedro here.... this is like "Waaaahooo"
Jim
K6'er Elite
Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim »

Peter, he is running a plain K6-2. Disabling the main Motherboard cache isn't going to help him. What settings do you reccomend for plain K6-2s?
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card
Jake
Newbie K6'er
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Aug 22, 2009 9:09 pm

Post by Jake »

DonPedro ... between you and Jim, you guys are just flat out genius! :D

Those Wpcredit settings where spot on....

Btw, I had learned my bits and bytes in electronics school back in 1977. But I'm never adverse to a refresher course.

All that aside, you got one happy camper here, I'll just skim the highlights here ...

Write allocate stays on via the latest bios flash, all 768 meg.

Everest 220
Mem read went from 285 to 339 Solid
Mem latency went form 279 to 229 Solid

Now the strange part, was getting mem write in the 125 range, played around with some different sticks of ram and when I put things back it had fallen from 125 to 105.... the wpcredit settings pushed it back up to a varying 125 to 130.

The other really note worthy one was location 41 ...turning off MB cache and turning on fast dram read.
I could notice the difference there instantly.

I need to learn how to use Wpcrset, and Jim had mentioned something about tag settings?? I'm all ears .. :)

Thanks a bunch
Jake
DonPedro
K6'er Elite
Posts: 578
Joined: Wed Jul 27, 2005 2:11 pm

Post by DonPedro »

jake,

since you are running a non "+" k6-2 cpu you should definitely KEEP mainboard-cache turned ON although everest memory write-scores are telling you otherwise. the problem with everest bench routines is that they are somehow "meaningless" when it comes to "real-world" performance. their memory test routines do nothing useful except measuring memory throughput, they achieve no meaningful goal beyond. in this regard they might fool you. for example locate a copy of the tool superpi on the internet, download it. this tool computes xx digits of the number pi, so it does something "useful". it tells you also the time needed to do that. so run this "real world" bench-tool one time with mainboard cache enabled (and also apply all appropriate wpcr-tweaks) and a second time with mb-cache turned off (wpcr-tweaks applied). where everest would lead you to believe that it is better to go along with mb-cache disabled, real world applications will speak a whole different language.

re wpcrset-tool: beware that if you use this tool to automatically adjust (tweak) the machine when the systems boots (that is actually its job and frees you from keying in the tweaks by yourself via wpcredit) you might run into trouble, because in case you tweaked too much the system might not boot and you would need a second os-installation (or need to boot from a good old msdos-disk) that allows you to delete (or better rename) the startup-job. in order to do that you would need access to the system32-folder of your operating system where the file to rename is stored: wpcrset.sys. this file is actually a device-driver that is automatically loaded very early in the boot process.

re wpcredit: I suggest you play around and find the best and most robust tweak settings for your system via wpcredit before you use wpcrset. wpcredit allows you to save your settings and of course to load your once saved settings, which makes the whole process a lot more convenient.
Jake
Newbie K6'er
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Aug 22, 2009 9:09 pm

Post by Jake »

DonPedro wrote:jake,

. for example locate a copy of the tool superpi on the internet, download it. this tool computes xx digits of the number pi, so it does something "useful". it tells you also the time needed to do that. so run this "real world" bench-tool one time with mainboard cache enabled (and also apply all appropriate wpcr-tweaks) and a second time with mb-cache turned off (wpcr-tweaks applied). where everest would lead you to believe that it is better to go along with mb-cache disabled, real world applications will speak a whole different language.

.
Oh my, had a feeling I should not have told you about turning off that cache. My waaahooo was prompted precisely because of real world performance, not because of Everest. Everest just reflected what I was
seeing elsewhere. Some examples ...

Have a program here that searches 8 jet databases simultaneously (key word or phrase) ...trimmed a full 2seconds off avg search time. (about 80 megs )

Directx benchmark from old Pcplayer set ....Frames per second jumped from 30 to 34 ...solid.

Web pages now load like I was using my 1.2 ghz laptop with Xp pro.

WebCam of Kings highway in myrtle beach that also gives FPS, went from 2.14 to 3.01.

With Faststone viewer, it used to be, it I tryed to scroll the thumbnails too fast...they would smear briefly....that does not happen now.

Individually, each one might otherwise be explained ....but all at the same time is just too significant.

I have a bootable mirror of Drive C hanging on the 2nd IDE channel, any problems, I just goto bios, swithch to ide "1" instead of "0" boot from the mirror.

My point is, what looked improbable even 2 days ago...happened . and you guys kicked open the door for me......it would have taken me weeks/months of study and reading otherwise.

All I can say is Thanks

Jake
Jim
K6'er Elite
Posts: 1745
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:10 pm
Location: Toronto

Post by Jim »

I heard you say something about 768 Meg. - Presumably SDRAM. Windows 98 can recognize any amount of SDRAM you throw at it; but it can only use 256 Meg unless you install the "Unofficial Service Pack", which raises the usable amount of RAM to 4 Gig. For that reason I highly reccomend the "Unofficial Service Pack" though it has to be installed immediately after loading Windows, before anything else. The reason for this, is the"Unofficial Service Pack" WILL overwrite newer files with older versions without telling you about it. So It is best installed before anything else, and especially before Windows is "updated".

Re Tag Settings : You will find them in the lateral "40" row in the "00", "01", and "02" positions. Don't ask me what settings are best. I have never been able to use WPCredit on my P5A-B boards because every time I try I get a message that says "Device ID Differs".

One other thing. I am very surprized that you seem to be getting better results with your onboard cache disabled with a plain K6-2. Have you tried enabling it and leaving all other settings the same as what you use when it is disabled to see what that will give you? (Possibly a system crash, - but it is worth trying to see if that will give you still better results.)
Superpuppy 3
K6-3+ 450 ACZ (6x100)
DFI K6BV3+/66 Rev B2 (2 Meg) w/ 2x28mm Chipset Fans
2x256 Meg PC 133 Hynix SDRAM
1x 20G Maxtor (7200)
2x 80G Maxtor (7200) Ducted w/ 2x486 Fans Mount
52/24/52/16 LG CDR/RW/DVD
8/4/3/12/24/16/32 LG Super Multi
ATI 9000 aiw Radeon AGP
SB Audigy 1 MP3 Sound
CMD 649 IDE Controller
NEC USB 2 Card
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