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Win98 Swap file

Posted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 8:57 pm
by KGB
Is it necessary if you have 512Mb of memory installed? I've "heard" many times over that Win9X/ME does not and could not utilize any further than 512. Is this true? If so, can I go about disabling it in the operating system.

This question is being posed for my K6-2 setup, which is generally more stabler under Win98se. I installed it without any issues today, and haven't run any prime95 or everest tests yet. Though I am certain I don't need nor would require it.

What are your thoughts? Thanks for looking.

Posted: Sat Apr 08, 2006 12:28 am
by Nohr
This Unofficial 98 SE Service Pack claims to solve the >512MB problem.

Posted: Mon May 08, 2006 3:29 am
by Jim
In practice, I have found that WIN98-SE is incapable of using more that 256 Meg of RAM without the "Unofficial Service Pack". The "Unofficial Service Pack" raises that limit supposedly to 4 Gig. I have not been able to confirm that; but it does definitely remove the 256 Meg restriction.

One downside of the "Unofficial Service Pack" is that it changes some of your icons to the WIN2K versions, like it or not; (and I don't). Another downside is that it overwrites some newer files with older versions without mentioning it. THAT causes problems with some software.

The way to get around that, is to load the "Unofficial Service Pack" early in the install sequence before you update "Windoze". Since the "Unofficial Service Pack" is composed of various "Windoze Updates" loading it on top of a fresh install is not going to overwrite anything newer.

Something else that I just tonight found out, is that with 768 Meg of RAM installed; and the "Unofficial Service Pack" loaded, Windoze, left to its own devices, will set the swapfile size to "0 Megabytes".

Posted: Tue May 09, 2006 6:03 am
by Jim
Addendum: Some people are going to think : "What is he talking about? - I have 384, (or 512 or some such), Meg of RAM; and Windows uses all of it." True and false. Windoze will RECOGNIZE and REPORT any amount of RAM your board will support; BUT it won't USE more than 256 Meg without the "Unofficial Service Pack". If you doubt that, install Norton Utilities 2000, and setup "System Doctor" so as to monitor RAM usage, and leave it open while running your various applications. 256 Meg, (261xxx k), is the max you will find used no matter what application you run.

Then install the "Unofficial Service Pack"; and "Voila" up the RAM usage goes. - 350Meg typical, 490Meg occasionally etc.

Posted: Tue May 09, 2006 2:57 pm
by KGB
Jim, Nohr
I downloaded the unofficial Win98 update from 9Down sometime ago, but my question is regarding the swap file. Maybe I didn't make it so clear in my initial post. I remember back in '97 when the standard memory in systems were 32 or 64 MB of ram, Prior to the Windows 98 release. Win98 being a derivative of Windows 95, programmers obviously felt compelled to create a SWAP file, in order to increase the amount of RAM available to the processor.

With the 512mb installed, does it seem necessary to utilize the Swap file? Seems unnecessary to me. (Besides all the other good points you've made about the feasability of RAM greater than 256)

Posted: Tue May 09, 2006 9:40 pm
by Jim
Like I said, If you have the "Unofficial Service Pack" installed, and the amount of installed RAM is high enough, (768 Meg), Windoze itself will set the swapfile size to 0 Meg. Why? What swapfile size are you getting w/ 512 Meg of RAM and the Unofficial Service Pack?

Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 5:33 am
by KachiWachi
Jim - Does it actually set the file size to zero (turns it off) or does it set a MinSize/MaxSize and only utilize 0 MB?

Some programs are actually written to utilize the swapfile for things it will need, but not right away (they actually write to the swapfile). Without one, these programs might act *funny*.

Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 6:33 am
by Jim
Kachi : Settings are:
1) Let Windoze manage my virtual memory settings. [Recommended]
2) Minimum = 0
3) Maximum = No Maximum

System Doctor is reporting a Swap File size of 0 Meg. It is also reporting Swap File Usage as 0 Meg.
Speed Disk, (which shows the Swap File in a different colour), shows no swap file present.
Disk usage software, (Windoze and other), shows dramatically increased available disk space available in my 3.2 Gig "C" partition.

BTW, What did you think of the "display" I designed for SP-3 ?

Posted: Thu May 11, 2006 6:48 am
by KachiWachi
Will reply to that over there. :wink:

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2006 10:09 pm
by Jim
K, On the subject of tyhe "Moronsh-t Windopes 98 SE" Swapfile, here is another take. I commonly work w/ very large files. Sometimes as much as 2.5 Gig; but often between 1 and 1.7 Gig; and I am having problems trying to set my "Swapfile" large enough to work w/ files like that. Obviously the machine doesn't have enough RAM to work with files that large without a swapfile, so when I open such a file it gets copied into the swapfile.

Now for reasons known best to moronsh-t the maximum file size, (of any type), that windopes can cope w/ is 4 Gig; and I have successfully created backup files that were just under the 4 Gig limit; but for some reason windopes will not set a swapfile size larger than 2047 Meg. If you open the control panel, click system, click performance, and click virtual memory, in theory you should be able to take control of the swapfile size away from windopes and set the size yourself.

Yet in practice when I set the minimum file size to 3600 Meg, and the maximum file size to 4000 Meg, (this in an empty 12 Gig partition), what happens is windopes says I have to restart the machine before the setting will take effect; then once restarted, if rechecked, you find that windopes has again taken over control of managing the swapfile from the user; and though the settings that I set are there, they are greyed out and the actual swapfile size is 2047 Meg.

So why does it matter? Right now I am working w/ a scan file that is a bit upwards of 1.2 Gig; (20640 by 20651 Pixels). It has been my experience that in order to get best results in image processing, the pixel dimensions of the file should be evenly divisable by the screen resolution. I would therefore like to crop the file to 19968 by 19968 pixels before starting processing it. What happens when I go to do that is the crop functions ok; but when I go to save the cropped image, I get a message "Not Enough Memory". This is because Moronsh-t designed Windopes in such a manner that files which have been copied into the swapfile because they have been used by a program cannot be overwritten or deleted until the program is closed; and in some cases not even then. (in these latter cases a restart is required to delete the file).

Now because the file was originally copied into the swapfile, that uses 1.2 gig. Cropping the file uses still more as the file gets copied back into the swapfile in its revised version. Go to save the file; and you run out of memory!! And it takes about 20 Minutes for each step. What a PO!!

Anybody know a way to make the user settings stick? I have managed to do it before, but I don't know how. Probably before the latest "Upgrades" from Moronsh-t.

Well, I figured it out again. Trick is to : EDIT : Be sure to remove the mask before saving. That makes a big difference. i.e. it allows you to get by w/ a lousy 2047 Meg swapfile. Whis is too small for the kind of work I do.